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Contest #2 - VOTING: Link
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Contest #2 - Benelux Cobbled Classics - VOTING

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Contest #2 - Benelux Cobbled Classics - VOTING

Post by emmea90 »

Contest #2 - Benelux Cobbled Classics - VOTING

In this topic you can vote for the Benelux Cobbled Classics, according to the following rules.


How to vote

1 - You have to judge the track according to the requirements.
The 2nd contest of the season will be about Benelux Cobbled Classics. You are called to re-invent the following classics
  • Omloop Het Nieuwsblad
  • Kuurne-Bruxelles-Kuurne
  • Ronde Van Drenthe
  • De Panne Classic
  • E3 Harelbeke
  • Gent-Wevelgem
  • Dwaars Door Vlaanderen
  • Ronde Van Vlaanderen
Constraints are the following ones:
  • General
    • All classics must start and finish into different cities from the original ones. 2019 cities are the one for reference.
    • You can change names of the classics that contains a city in the name, changing the city
    • You can use cities in 'other' classics, example Ypres cannot be used in Gent-Wevelgem (as it's start) but can be used in Ronde Van Drenthe
    • You are not asked to keep the same zone, but classics should be entirely be in Benelux
    • There should be at least three finishes in Netherlands
    • Classics should present the same or at least similar characteristics of the original ones
  • Omloop Het Nieuwsblad
    • Race is intended to be a lighter version of the Ronde. Should be won by people that usually places in top 20-25 of Ronde, not cutting them out. Should not be for pure sprinters (like Viviani). Distance not more than 210 Km.
  • Kuurne-Bruxelles-Kuurne
    • Race should have a middle section with cobbled bergs for attacks, then a final circuit that put sprinters back in field, giving them 60-70% chances to win the race.
  • Ronde Van Drenthe
    • It's a sprinter race with some cobbled sections sprinters have less chances than in Kuurne and present no bergs.
  • De Panne Classic
    • Pure sprinter race.
  • E3 Harelbeke
    • Race more similar to a Ronde. Harder than Omloop but easier than Ronde.
  • Gent-Wevelgem
    • It's a race in which pure sprinters can have a 50-50% chance with attackers.
  • Dwaars Door Vlaanderen
    • It's a <200 Km race that present some climbs but only few cobbled so climbers like Valverde can make a top 10-15. Sprinters are definitely taken out of the field
  • Ronde Van Vlaanderen
    • Think there is nothing to explain here. It's THE monument. It's forbbidden to re-propose the old Ronde Finish with Muur and Bosberg
Please use the "ASO 2019 profile" of the race, in 3d mode for all the races. For the Ronde Van Drenthe use the Scheldeprijs profile.

You have to deliver two routes, one for the Men's races and one for the Women's races with classics inserted in that order.
2 - You have to write in a post your best FIVE routes, from worse to best, providing a brief motivation for each choice




How does it work?
- First choice got 6 points, second 4, third 3, fourth 2 and fifth 1 point.
- Presentation bonus grant you 3 points (we will add later with penalties who took the bonus)
- Ranking will be made according to points obtained
- In case of equality I will decide the winner
- You can also comment other people's reviews regarding your or other one's routes

Who can vote?
- Every user that submitted a contest (full points vote)
- Every user in the La Flamme Rouge Staff (Emmea90, Pigna, Sagan99, Matthorse, Nasdon33, Linkinito, Bose12)
- Every user that has registered BEFORE today and has at least 10 tracks in the editor. In this case, his votes counts half of the points scale

- Every user that submitted a contest and doesn't submit a valid vote (with 5 choices and motivations) will get a 10 points penalty for all his routes.
- It's FORBBIDDEN to ask for votes. Who will be caught public or privately asking for a vote to some users will get a 50 points penalty in first instance, then the exclusion from all the contests of the year
- Vote penalties for unpracticable routes will be assigned by staff during this phase

Requisites for the +3 bonus
- Providing link of the tour in the post
- Providing viewable image of each stage with a description in the post of at least Men Elite races

Deadline for vote phase is april 3, h 23.59

Diego12Alpe: ME - maps/tours/view/13885 / WE - maps/tours/view/13930
Zaufkauf: ME - maps/tours/view/14040 / WE - maps/tours/view/14039
jibvalverde: ME - maps/tours/view/13962 / WE - maps/tours/view/13963 +3 presentation
Arnorius: ME - maps/tours/view/13900 / WE - maps/tours/view/13901 + 3 presentation
Paoloagb: ME - maps/tours/view/14118 / WE - maps/tours/view/14119
JoostvandeBeek: ME - maps/tours/view/14044 / WE - maps/tours/view/14110 + 3 presentation
Xander66: ME - maps/tours/view/14121 / WE - maps/tours/view/14122
jajoejoe: ME - maps/tours/view/14128 / WE - maps/tours/view/14129 + 3 presentation
taaramae_crack: ME - maps/tours/view/14131 / WE - maps/tours/view/14132
improb: ME - maps/tours/view/14133 / WE - maps/tours/view/14134

Not admitted
Mauro: ME - maps/tours/view/14023 / WE - maps/tours/view/14024
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Re: Contest #2 - Benelux Cobbled Classics - VOTING

Post by jajoejoe »

I didn’t get bonus points for presentation again, but this time the photos of the stages do work. Sorry for saying this again if it isn’t justified like last time.

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Re: Contest #2 - Benelux Cobbled Classics - VOTING

Post by emmea90 »

jajoejoe wrote:
22/03/2020, 20:15
I didn’t get bonus points for presentation again, but this time the photos of the stages do work. Sorry for saying this again if it isn’t justified like last time.
You are right this time, i forgot you and xander
Software Engineer, Cycling Fanatic

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Re: Contest #2 - Benelux Cobbled Classics - VOTING

Post by Arnorius »

Just saw that paoloagb's men and women routes got mixed up, maybe you better correct it :)

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Re: Contest #2 - Benelux Cobbled Classics - VOTING

Post by Diego12Alpe »

FIRST PLACE: jibvalverde
[ME] I think you made very good races, well structured and with sense. The only thing I can say is that maybe more cobbled sectors in Charleroi-Maastricht would be nice.
[WE] Also good and realistic races, great job.

SECOND PLACE: jajoejoe
[ME] The races you made in other place than it's original zone I think are good, but in general I think your races need a little bit to be the best in the contest.
[WE] Same opinion for your women's races than men's races.

THIRD PLACE: taaramae_crack
[ME] I think in your Omloop Het Nieuwsblad the distance betwen the last climb and the finish line should be shorter, and your E3 BinckBank Classic needs more cobbled climbs. Maybe your Brussel - Kuurne - Brussel need more hardness in the middle part.
[WE] Same opinion as in the men's Omploop Het Nieuwsblad and Brussel - Kuurne - Brussel. I also think the E3 BinckBank Classic needs more climbs and also cobbled climbs.

FOURTH PLACE: JoostvandeBeek
[ME] I think in Circuit La Dernière Heure the key part of the race is far from the finish line, your Zeist - Arnhem - Zeist need more cobbled sectors and the Antwerpen - Tienen have to be harder than it is.
[WE] I think the same about women's Circuit La Derniere Heure and Antwerpen - Tienen than men's. In Zeist - Arnhem - Zeist should be cobbled sectors.

[ME] I think Liedekerke-Kortrijk-Liedekerke would be better with more distance betwen the last climb and the finish line, and E3 Binckbank Classic would be better with the last climb at 10 or 15 kilometers of the finish line, not at 30km. To me have just one cobbled sector in Eindhoven - Sittard I think is a bad idea.
[WE] In E3 Binckbank Classic and Eindhoven - Sittard I think the same as in the men's races, but I think your women's races are better done than the men's ones.

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Re: Contest #2 - Benelux Cobbled Classics - VOTING

Post by jibvalverde »

FIRST PLACE : Jajoejoe

Good Omloop but i think Saint-Laurent is too much, too near to the finish
Good and original Waterloo-Geraardsbergen-Waterloo. Love it.
Classic Drenthe but too hard. It’s supposed to be for sprinteur
De Panne without surprise but good
Nice E3 BinckBank Classic even if i think it’s a little too easy
GW is good too but i regret the simple part in the middle
Too many cobbled in Dwaars ! It’s supposed to be a mix between flanders and Liege ^^
Nice Ronde, quite similar to what i’vde done for the final but Varent is not cobbled all along and i found that is a big change in your race because last 2 bergs aren’t cobbled
Not ok with all ideas but well traced.

SECOND PLACE : Diego12Alpe

Good Omloop Nieuwsblad
Good exploitation of Kapelmuur but maybe a little tough for a KBK…
Not a fan of your Drenthe, too many hard cobbled in the second part of the race
Good Terneuzen Classic
Not a fan of arrival in cobbled of Gerardgreen
Eindhoven-Maastricht is way too hard for a GW…
Good Dwaars door Vlaanderen
I really like your Ronde but why make GP E3 so different ?
Very good women’races each time.

THIRD PLACE : Arnorius

Original Omloop with Quaremont-Paterberg and an another cobbled road between them.
I find your Liedekerke-Kortrijk-Liedekerke too hard for a KBK
Your Ronde van Zeeuws-Vlaanderen is magnificent but too many cobbled in second part. It supposed to be a sprinter classic
Nice Maasvlakte Classic. Simple, efficient. Not very sure of your final but it’s ok
Your E3 Binckbank Classic’s final is too easy at my opinion. Last berg at 32km of the finish is too far.
Not fan of Eindhoven – Sittard. A GW without cobbles is not a GW.
I like more your Dwars, even if most of the points of your climbs are bad positionned
Not fan of the arrival of the Ronde in the cobbled hill of Geraardsbergen


I love your Omloop, which is like the old one but with new cobbles. Very interesting.
Very good Brugge>Waterloo. Looks like a KBK, so excellent.
Drenthe is supposed to be for sprinter. Too many hard cobbled in second part.
Perfect Ronde van Holland
Your GP E3 is very good but way too short. At least 20km too short.
A good Lokeren Ingelmunster, harder than GW but balanced.
Your Dwaars Door Limburg is far away from what Dwaars is supposed to be. Not enough bergs.
Ronde is way too hard… Too many climbs, too many cobbled and it’s me who says that ^^

FIFTH PLACE : Taaramae_crack

No cobbled bergs in last 27km, it’s too much for my taste
Love your KBK
I would love your Drenthe… in the other way
Good De Panne with just enough cobbled, not too much
GP E3 is way too easy…
Good GW, similar to the real one
Love your Dwaars, realy well balanced between cobbled bergs and brutal hills
Not a fan of your Ronde. I don’t like the idea of an arrival in the Muur. Last cobbled berg before that is 29km to finish : way too much for me.

For the others, I decide de tell you what i thought even if you're not in top 5.
Zaufkauf :

Omloop way too easy. Not enough bergs… Nearly better in women’s version
Like the originality of Wavre-Wavre but too easy once more, even for a KBK
Drenthe has cobbled in first part, not second
Noord-Holland Classic simple but efficient
Once again, not enough bergs and too far from the arrival. It’s supposed to be GP E3…
Too easy, even for a GW
I really like your Dwaars, even if i regret arrival on cobbles
3 cobbled bergs in 90 last kms, it’s way not enough… Like major of your races.

JoostvandeBeek :

Very good Circuit La Dernière Heure. Original, nice exploitation of Tournai. Maybe a little too easy in last 40 kms for Omloop.
Beautiful Zeist - Arnhem – Zeist. Nothing else to say.
Nice Omloop van de Braakman but Drenthe is supposed to be more for sprinter than that
Nice Katwijk Classic, very La Panne style
Not fan of your E3 Binckbanck Classic but it’s well designed
Nice Antwerpen – Tienen, very like GW
Dwars door Limburg is well thought but Wingaardsberg is not a cobbled road but a forest road, not praticable
Not fan of your Ronde. Berg ten Houte is not cobbled and i would have prefered Kruisberg-Kortkeer-Taaienberg, like you did for women’s race.
Too many mistakes but some good ideas. I like most of your women’races.

Xander66 :

Omloop original but a little too easy for me
Good Brussel - Kuurne – Brussel
Ronde van Brabant too hard. Supposed to be for sprinters. Yours is not.
Classic Driedaagse Utrecht – Delft. But good.
Not fan of E3 Poperinge and its 4 ascents of Kemmelberg
Venlo – Maastricht and À travers la Wallonie too easy once more
Not fan of your Ronde and its cobbled sectors to finish.
Women’s race well traced

Improb :

Sorry but, between races in wrong order and no localisations of climbs and cobbles, difficult to estimate your races.

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