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2021 Season Contests
Contest #7: USA Cycling Race - VOTING
Contest #8: La Vuelta 2021

Contest #6 - Tour de France [Cat. 1] - Voting

Compete in the contests and become the best stagemaker!
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Contest #6 - Tour de France [Cat. 1] - Voting

Post by emmea90 »

Contest #6 - Tour de France [Cat. 1] - Voting

In this topic you can vote for the Tour de France, according to the following rules.

PLEASE READ ALL THE POST BEFORE VOTING

How to vote

1 - You have to judge the track according to the requirements: contests/contest-tour-france-2021-t7416.html

2 - You have to write in a post your best FIVE routes, from worse to best, providing a brief motivation for each choice
FIFTH PLACE
(Motivation)

FOURTH PLACE
(Motivation)

THIRD PLACE
(Motivation)

SECOND PLACE
(Motivation)

FIRST PLACE
(Motivation)
How does it work?
- First choice got 6 points, second 4, third 3, fourth 2 and fifth 1 point.
- Presentation bonus grant you 3 points (we will add later with penalties who took the bonus)
- Ranking will be made according to points obtained
- In case of equality I will decide the winner
- YOU CAN'T VOTE FOR YOURSELF
- You can also comment other people's reviews regarding your or other one's routes
- YOU CAN'T CHANGE YOUR VOTE ONCE SUBMITTED

Who can vote?
- Every user that submitted a contest (full points vote)
- Every user in the La Flamme Rouge Staff (Emmea90, Pigna, Sagan99, Matthorse, Nasdon33, Linkinito, Bose12)
- Every user that has registered BEFORE today and has at least 10 tracks in the editor. In this case, his votes counts half of the points scale

Penalties
- Every user that submitted a contest and doesn't submit a valid vote (with 5 choices and motivations) will get a 10 points penalty for all his routes.
- It's FORBBIDDEN to ask for votes. Who will be caught public or privately asking for a vote to some users will get a 50 points penalty in first instance, then the exclusion from all the contests of the year
- Vote penalties for unpracticable routes will be assigned by staff during this phase

Requisites for the +3 bonus
- Providing link of the tour in the post
- Providing viewable image of each stage with a description in the post

Deadline for vote phase is august 15, h 23.59

Routes:
Mauro: maps/tours/view/18943 +4 presentation
Lukkier: maps/tours/view/19040 +4 presentation
Belgian4444: maps/tours/view/19027 +4 presentation
Will4563: maps/tours/view/19093 +4 presentation
Davandluz: maps/tours/view/19052 +4 presentation
Jajoejoe: maps/tours/view/19031 +4 presentation
Benoit.guillot: maps/tours/view/19024 +4 presentation
Antoinvds: maps/tours/view/19111 +4 presentation
Fyr3: maps/tours/view/18900 +4 presentation
JibValverde: maps/tours/view/19157 +4 presentation
Iamceekae: maps/tours/view/19170
Micek_52: maps/tours/view/19198 +4 presentation
Pyrozooka0: maps/tours/view/19199 +4 presentation
Alegard: maps/tours/view/19133 +4 presentation
Anderson: maps/tours/view/19085 +4 presentation
Jeko: maps/tours/view/19151 +4 presentation
JoostvandeBeek: maps/tours/view/19123 +4 presentation
Diego12Alpe: maps/tours/view/19070 +4 presentation
Bocmanis82: maps/tours/view/19164 +4 presentation
Nebe: maps/tours/view/19129 +4 presentation
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Re: Contest #6 - Tour de France [Cat. 1] - Voting

Post by Micek_52 »

.
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Re: Contest #6 - Tour de France [Cat. 1] - Voting

Post by Micek_52 »

emmea90 wrote: 27/07/2021, 21:10 Contest #6 - Tour de France [Cat. 1] - Voting
Hey,
No offence, but I think you might have forgotten my route :)

The link is: www.la-flamme-rouge.eu/maps/tours/view/19198 and the tour was posted at 0:07 on 22. July - within the time limt.
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Re: Contest #6 - Tour de France [Cat. 1] - Voting

Post by Fyr3 »

Wait Requisites for the +3 bonus yet its listed as +4? :D
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Re: Contest #6 - Tour de France [Cat. 1] - Voting

Post by Micek_52 »

Fyr3 wrote: 28/07/2021, 0:42 Wait Requisites for the +3 bonus yet its listed as +4? :D
3 points for presentation and 1 point for correct use of spoiler. :)
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Re: Contest #6 - Tour de France [Cat. 1] - Voting

Post by Micek_52 »

Here are my votes. As usual I went with the scoring system. You start with 30 points, and get 1 point penalty for each constraint, that wasn't met.

9 of 19 contestants got all 30 points, I eliminated one, because their tour was longer than 3.500 kilometres, and three others, who had a flat stage 19 followed by a ITT and another flat stage. Then I decided between the remaining five:

1st - Anderson
Simmilarly well designed as the lukkier's one, but you placed your time trial in a better position, as stage 16 between two M.Mountain stages, and you have a three mountain stage finale.

2nd - lukkier
This one doesn't have safety issues in the start. It is a nice tour, however the 1st place was better, as that one had an ITT slightly earlier in the race, and I am really not a fan of ITT's on stage 20.

3rd - nebe
Simmilar problem as the 4th place. The finale of the stage is the same as in the actual Tour, and we know, that there was carnage just before the final climb.

4th - benoît.guillot
As much as I like your ribin stage, I believe that it should not be the first stage, when everybody is nervous and fighting for the first yellow jersey. If it was the 2nd stage after an ITT or something, it would be totally acceptable.

5th - Bocmanis82
You have three ITT's of actually quite substantial length. This is not really Tour de France like, so unfortunately I could not place you any higher. Also, the first two are quite close to eachother.
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Re: Contest #6 - Tour de France [Cat. 1] - Voting

Post by Bocmanis82 »

Micek_52 wrote: 28/07/2021, 14:14 You have three ITT's of actually quite substantial length. This is not really Tour de France like, so unfortunately I could not place you any higher. Also, the first two are quite close to eachother.
I had 2 ITT and 1 TTT
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Re: Contest #6 - Tour de France [Cat. 1] - Voting

Post by Micek_52 »

Bocmanis82 wrote: 28/07/2021, 17:18
Micek_52 wrote: 28/07/2021, 14:14 You have three ITT's of actually quite substantial length. This is not really Tour de France like, so unfortunately I could not place you any higher. Also, the first two are quite close to eachother.
I had 2 ITT and 1 TTT
Yeah, that is true, but it is still 3 TT's. Doesnt matter if its ITT or TTT.
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Re: Contest #6 - Tour de France [Cat. 1] - Voting

Post by Fyr3 »

Micek_52 wrote: 28/07/2021, 14:14 Here are my votes. As usual I went with the scoring system. You start with 30 points, and get 1 point penalty for each constraint, that wasn't met.

9 of 19 contestants got all 30 points, I eliminated one, because their tour was longer than 3.500 kilometres, and three others, who had a flat stage 19 followed by a ITT and another flat stage. Then I decided between the remaining five:

1st - Anderson
Simmilarly well designed as the lukkier's one, but you placed your time trial in a better position, as stage 16 between two M.Mountain stages, and you have a three mountain stage finale.

2nd - lukkier
This one doesn't have safety issues in the start. It is a nice tour, however the 1st place was better, as that one had an ITT slightly earlier in the race, and I am really not a fan of ITT's on stage 20.

3rd - nebe
Simmilar problem as the 4th place. The finale of the stage is the same as in the actual Tour, and we know, that there was carnage just before the final climb.

4th - benoît.guillot
As much as I like your ribin stage, I believe that it should not be the first stage, when everybody is nervous and fighting for the first yellow jersey. If it was the 2nd stage after an ITT or something, it would be totally acceptable.

5th - Bocmanis82
You have three ITT's of actually quite substantial length. This is not really Tour de France like, so unfortunately I could not place you any higher. Also, the first two are quite close to eachother.
Wait, which constraint didn't I meet? I understand if its personal ones but I met all the ones that Emmea had given for the contest?

- Gran Depart should be kept in Bretagne. So Stages 1, 2 and 3 should start and finish in Bretagne, Stage 4 shall start there. (Stage 1 /2 /3 yes, with La Roche-Bernard for stage 4.)
- Of course you have to end TDF in Champs-Elysees. This means that stage 20-21 transfer shall be 'realistic' (ends on Champs with a TT, same transfer as real life.)
- You cannot repeat key parts of Tour de France 2020 real stages (as far as I am aware the only "repeated part" from 2020 would be the Mente / Port de Bales, but these were not listed as key parts under the criteria (peyresourde only))
- You have to put a stage start or a stage finish in at least 7 different france regions (criteria met)
- Alps before Pyrenees is a constraint this year. (criteria met)
- Also inserting Mont Ventoux from Bedoin in the route is a constraint. (criteria met)
- Again, like 2020, you are not allowed to leave France for the whole route. All the Kms of Tour de France shall be in France. The only ones exception admitted will be Monaco and Andorre. (no km outside France)
- You must have from 5 to 7 stages for pure sprinters, Paris included - and no more than 2 of them consequently (criteria met, Paris counts if flat but doesn't have to be flat afaik)
- There should be at least 2 high mountain stages that does NOT end in a MTF (stages 14 and 17)

The only one I can see confusion in is the second from last. Emmea said that Paris doesn't have to be a sprint finish, but if it is one it counts as far as I am aware. Or maybe the key parts if that wasn't clear either.
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Re: Contest #6 - Tour de France [Cat. 1] - Voting

Post by Micek_52 »

Fyr3 wrote: 28/07/2021, 21:33
Micek_52 wrote: 28/07/2021, 14:14 Here are my votes. As usual I went with the scoring system. You start with 30 points, and get 1 point penalty for each constraint, that wasn't met.

9 of 19 contestants got all 30 points, I eliminated one, because their tour was longer than 3.500 kilometres, and three others, who had a flat stage 19 followed by a ITT and another flat stage. Then I decided between the remaining five:

1st - Anderson
Simmilarly well designed as the lukkier's one, but you placed your time trial in a better position, as stage 16 between two M.Mountain stages, and you have a three mountain stage finale.

2nd - lukkier
This one doesn't have safety issues in the start. It is a nice tour, however the 1st place was better, as that one had an ITT slightly earlier in the race, and I am really not a fan of ITT's on stage 20.

3rd - nebe
Simmilar problem as the 4th place. The finale of the stage is the same as in the actual Tour, and we know, that there was carnage just before the final climb.

4th - benoît.guillot
As much as I like your ribin stage, I believe that it should not be the first stage, when everybody is nervous and fighting for the first yellow jersey. If it was the 2nd stage after an ITT or something, it would be totally acceptable.

5th - Bocmanis82
You have three ITT's of actually quite substantial length. This is not really Tour de France like, so unfortunately I could not place you any higher. Also, the first two are quite close to eachother.
Wait, which constraint didn't I meet? I understand if its personal ones but I met all the ones that Emmea had given for the contest?

- Gran Depart should be kept in Bretagne. So Stages 1, 2 and 3 should start and finish in Bretagne, Stage 4 shall start there. (Stage 1 /2 /3 yes, with La Roche-Bernard for stage 4.)
- Of course you have to end TDF in Champs-Elysees. This means that stage 20-21 transfer shall be 'realistic' (ends on Champs with a TT, same transfer as real life.)
- You cannot repeat key parts of Tour de France 2020 real stages (as far as I am aware the only "repeated part" from 2020 would be the Mente / Port de Bales, but these were not listed as key parts under the criteria (peyresourde only))
- You have to put a stage start or a stage finish in at least 7 different france regions (criteria met)
- Alps before Pyrenees is a constraint this year. (criteria met)
- Also inserting Mont Ventoux from Bedoin in the route is a constraint. (criteria met)
- Again, like 2020, you are not allowed to leave France for the whole route. All the Kms of Tour de France shall be in France. The only ones exception admitted will be Monaco and Andorre. (no km outside France)
- You must have from 5 to 7 stages for pure sprinters, Paris included - and no more than 2 of them consequently (criteria met, Paris counts if flat but doesn't have to be flat afaik)
- There should be at least 2 high mountain stages that does NOT end in a MTF (stages 14 and 17)

The only one I can see confusion in is the second from last. Emmea said that Paris doesn't have to be a sprint finish, but if it is one it counts as far as I am aware. Or maybe the key parts if that wasn't clear either.
I checked my scoring sheet. Your route (ID 18900) scored 28 points, meaning you took 2 penalties, namely:
- 1 point penalty for repeating 2020 key parts in stage 18. Mente was OK, but Bales as penultimate climb counts as a key point.
- 1 point penalty for 8 flat stages (3,4,7,10,13,15,16,20). Now I know you marked 13 as Hilly, but I personally counted it as a sprinters' stage, as the hard climbs are early on, and the last climb is easy and 40km from the finish.

Even if you got all 30 points, I would have a problem with the TT in Paris, as I think that the usual "parade ending" is a part of Tour de France tradition and race identity.
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Re: Contest #6 - Tour de France [Cat. 1] - Voting

Post by Fyr3 »

Micek_52 wrote: 28/07/2021, 22:34
Fyr3 wrote: 28/07/2021, 21:33
Micek_52 wrote: 28/07/2021, 14:14 Here are my votes. As usual I went with the scoring system. You start with 30 points, and get 1 point penalty for each constraint, that wasn't met.

9 of 19 contestants got all 30 points, I eliminated one, because their tour was longer than 3.500 kilometres, and three others, who had a flat stage 19 followed by a ITT and another flat stage. Then I decided between the remaining five:

1st - Anderson
Simmilarly well designed as the lukkier's one, but you placed your time trial in a better position, as stage 16 between two M.Mountain stages, and you have a three mountain stage finale.

2nd - lukkier
This one doesn't have safety issues in the start. It is a nice tour, however the 1st place was better, as that one had an ITT slightly earlier in the race, and I am really not a fan of ITT's on stage 20.

3rd - nebe
Simmilar problem as the 4th place. The finale of the stage is the same as in the actual Tour, and we know, that there was carnage just before the final climb.

4th - benoît.guillot
As much as I like your ribin stage, I believe that it should not be the first stage, when everybody is nervous and fighting for the first yellow jersey. If it was the 2nd stage after an ITT or something, it would be totally acceptable.

5th - Bocmanis82
You have three ITT's of actually quite substantial length. This is not really Tour de France like, so unfortunately I could not place you any higher. Also, the first two are quite close to eachother.
Wait, which constraint didn't I meet? I understand if its personal ones but I met all the ones that Emmea had given for the contest?

- Gran Depart should be kept in Bretagne. So Stages 1, 2 and 3 should start and finish in Bretagne, Stage 4 shall start there. (Stage 1 /2 /3 yes, with La Roche-Bernard for stage 4.)
- Of course you have to end TDF in Champs-Elysees. This means that stage 20-21 transfer shall be 'realistic' (ends on Champs with a TT, same transfer as real life.)
- You cannot repeat key parts of Tour de France 2020 real stages (as far as I am aware the only "repeated part" from 2020 would be the Mente / Port de Bales, but these were not listed as key parts under the criteria (peyresourde only))
- You have to put a stage start or a stage finish in at least 7 different france regions (criteria met)
- Alps before Pyrenees is a constraint this year. (criteria met)
- Also inserting Mont Ventoux from Bedoin in the route is a constraint. (criteria met)
- Again, like 2020, you are not allowed to leave France for the whole route. All the Kms of Tour de France shall be in France. The only ones exception admitted will be Monaco and Andorre. (no km outside France)
- You must have from 5 to 7 stages for pure sprinters, Paris included - and no more than 2 of them consequently (criteria met, Paris counts if flat but doesn't have to be flat afaik)
- There should be at least 2 high mountain stages that does NOT end in a MTF (stages 14 and 17)

The only one I can see confusion in is the second from last. Emmea said that Paris doesn't have to be a sprint finish, but if it is one it counts as far as I am aware. Or maybe the key parts if that wasn't clear either.
I checked my scoring sheet. Your route (ID 18900) scored 28 points, meaning you took 2 penalties, namely:
- 1 point penalty for repeating 2020 key parts in stage 18. Mente was OK, but Bales as penultimate climb counts as a key point.
- 1 point penalty for 8 flat stages (3,4,7,10,13,15,16,20). Now I know you marked 13 as Hilly, but I personally counted it as a sprinters' stage, as the hard climbs are early on, and the last climb is easy and 40km from the finish.

Even if you got all 30 points, I would have a problem with the TT in Paris, as I think that the usual "parade ending" is a part of Tour de France tradition and race identity.
Ah ok thanks for clearing it up. In all fairness you are probably right about stage 13 in some part, I would still classify it as hilly but on PCM I only just made it from the break (about 10 seconds) and even then it was only because I used 2 team mates on the flats between climbs.
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Re: Contest #6 - Tour de France [Cat. 1] - Voting

Post by Bocmanis82 »

Micek_52 wrote: 28/07/2021, 19:29
Bocmanis82 wrote: 28/07/2021, 17:18
Micek_52 wrote: 28/07/2021, 14:14 You have three ITT's of actually quite substantial length. This is not really Tour de France like, so unfortunately I could not place you any higher. Also, the first two are quite close to eachother.
I had 2 ITT and 1 TTT
Yeah, that is true, but it is still 3 TT's. Doesnt matter if its ITT or TTT.
Also, I disagree when you say that 3 TT's is not TDF like. ASO has recently cut TT length to give chance to French riders in GC. Therefore, some of recent TDF routes has looked like a shitty Vuelta routes. Normal TDF should have decent TT length.
In my TDF each TT is different- TTT ends with uphill finish to test teams on slightly different terrain than usual. First ITT is classical while final ITT has climb midstage but it is not mountain TT. So it is not the same excersize three times in Tour.
Also, hilly stages 2 & 5 should split peleton and there will be some time gaps before ITT of stage 7; early sprint stages are always ticky as well.
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Re: Contest #6 - Tour de France [Cat. 1] - Voting

Post by Fyr3 »

A reminder to those of you who haven't seen my route presentation (includes fixed profile errors etc): contests/contest-tour-france-2021-t7416-60.html

And here is a reminder of how I will be judging submissions (also can be found on the original contest but I will post it here for simplicity):

Transfers
-My ranking will be split into two parts and will take into account both the total transfer distance (excluding Paris) and the longest transfer (excluding paris.)
-I will also penalise if a transfer to Paris is not realistic (no TGV or flight back in reasonable time.)
-My main reference for total distance will be the UCI guidelines (2000km or less)
-I will also take into account the length / type of stage before and after a transfer (a longer one is acceptable in the case of a short road stage or time trial afterwards.)
-For transfer times I will use this website: https://www.oalley.fr/

UCI race regulations
-No more than 2 stages of 240km or more in length
-Time trials of no more than 60km in length
-Any circuit must be at least 15km in length
-Total distance must be less than 3500km
-Caravan must be able to pass the route (or at least the majority)

Finishes
-Final straight should be at least 200m for road stages.
-There should be enough room close to the finish line for important areas to be hosted such as the race podium and doping control checks.
-If there is not sufficient space at a finish, there must be relatively easy access to other important areas after the finish (e.g. the ability to descend Col du Portet and Superbagneres by cable car.)
-Road furniture to be kept to a minimum (items such as Bollards and potentially speed humps can be removed)
-There should be access for team cars and neutral service up any final climb to help the riders in the case of mechanicals.
-There should be a deviation for vehicles not crossing the finish line, in particular for stages ending on the flat.
-I will award each finish location a scale of 1 - 5, with a ranking of 5 meaning a finish area has all the capabilities of hosting a stage (Money for hosting the stage provided for instance by a nearby town or resort, area of significance (so not a random dead end) and so forth.) A ranking of 1 basically means I don't see any plausibility of a stage occuring there.

Route Climbs
-A range between 50 - 80 is preferable.
-A range of 5-8 HC climbs is preferable.
-Climbs should be accessible by the team cars and race organisers, and shouldn't have any problems such as long unlit tunnels or large sections of gravel.
-Any gravel climb (or for that matter sector) must either be one already used by pro races (e.g. on Paris Tours or in the case of Cobbles Roubaix) or must be accompanied by a screenshot showing feasibility.
-I will be harsh on any inclusions like the Parpaillon or Jandri.
-As specified in the contest they should not be important points on last year's route (I am however inclined against judgement for inclusion of Peyragudes or Peyresourde given it features on the actual route this year.)

Contest Rules
-All rules must of course have been adhered to.

Personal criteria
-At least 50km of time trialing because the Giro was targeted at the Climbers this year.
-At least 1 stage that features some kind of memorial or memory of a rider or famous moment in the race's history (Mourenx having crowned Eddy Merckx, passage beside the memorial to Fabio Casartelli, etc.)
-At least one new climb and new finish and new start town on the route (On my route that would be Domène as a start town, the Circuit de Charade as a finish, and the Col d'Ayen on stage 13.)
-At least one major French landmark / tourism attraction or historical site visited / passed by the Tour excluding Paris (in my case this would be the Passage du Gois, other examples might be the Notre Dame de la Garde in Marseille or a place like Futuroscope.
-At least one summit finish that isn't HC.
-At least one medium mountain stage that can shape the GC (e.g Mende.)
-A novelty on the route, this could be unpaved roads like Ribinou, or a never crossed region like the Verdon Gorges, or a stage with unique design like the Col du Portet stage in 2018.
-A healthy balance between climbers and all-rounders, this might for instance be 5-7 mountain stages and 1-2 time trials (3 if shorter length) and a mix of MTFs and descent finishes.
-Practicability in case of emergencies (E.g being able to move a finish if there is a landslide that takes out a bridge on a road before a stage, or being able to re-route in the case of seismic activity (in particular I think of the Col de Larche here.) I will be quite reasonable on this given the disaster at Tignes.
-Safety protocols such as avoiding unnecessary roads if they could be narrow / technical (this is in the UCI book however I want to be more lenient as if Tour designers are making these mistakes then what am I expecting of us?!)
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Re: Contest #6 - Tour de France [Cat. 1] - Voting

Post by Will4563 »

Micek_52 wrote: 28/07/2021, 14:14 Here are my votes. As usual I went with the scoring system. You start with 30 points, and get 1 point penalty for each constraint, that wasn't met.

9 of 19 contestants got all 30 points, I eliminated one, because their tour was longer than 3.500 kilometres, and three others, who had a flat stage 19 followed by a ITT and another flat stage. Then I decided between the remaining five:

1st - Anderson
Simmilarly well designed as the lukkier's one, but you placed your time trial in a better position, as stage 16 between two M.Mountain stages, and you have a three mountain stage finale.

2nd - lukkier
This one doesn't have safety issues in the start. It is a nice tour, however the 1st place was better, as that one had an ITT slightly earlier in the race, and I am really not a fan of ITT's on stage 20.

3rd - nebe
Simmilar problem as the 4th place. The finale of the stage is the same as in the actual Tour, and we know, that there was carnage just before the final climb.

4th - benoît.guillot
As much as I like your ribin stage, I believe that it should not be the first stage, when everybody is nervous and fighting for the first yellow jersey. If it was the 2nd stage after an ITT or something, it would be totally acceptable.

5th - Bocmanis82
You have three ITT's of actually quite substantial length. This is not really Tour de France like, so unfortunately I could not place you any higher. Also, the first two are quite close to eachother.
How many constraints did I make?
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Re: Contest #6 - Tour de France [Cat. 1] - Voting

Post by Micek_52 »

Will4563 wrote: 29/07/2021, 21:01
Micek_52 wrote: 28/07/2021, 14:14 Here are my votes. As usual I went with the scoring system. You start with 30 points, and get 1 point penalty for each constraint, that wasn't met.

9 of 19 contestants got all 30 points, I eliminated one, because their tour was longer than 3.500 kilometres, and three others, who had a flat stage 19 followed by a ITT and another flat stage. Then I decided between the remaining five:

1st - Anderson
Simmilarly well designed as the lukkier's one, but you placed your time trial in a better position, as stage 16 between two M.Mountain stages, and you have a three mountain stage finale.

2nd - lukkier
This one doesn't have safety issues in the start. It is a nice tour, however the 1st place was better, as that one had an ITT slightly earlier in the race, and I am really not a fan of ITT's on stage 20.

3rd - nebe
Simmilar problem as the 4th place. The finale of the stage is the same as in the actual Tour, and we know, that there was carnage just before the final climb.

4th - benoît.guillot
As much as I like your ribin stage, I believe that it should not be the first stage, when everybody is nervous and fighting for the first yellow jersey. If it was the 2nd stage after an ITT or something, it would be totally acceptable.

5th - Bocmanis82
You have three ITT's of actually quite substantial length. This is not really Tour de France like, so unfortunately I could not place you any higher. Also, the first two are quite close to eachother.
How many constraints did I make?
Your route (ID 19093) scored 29.5 points, meaning it took half a penalty, namely for having 8* flat stages (3,4,6,10,12,14,19,21). Same as Fyr3, you did classify 10 and 14 as hilly, but I determined them as flat. Stage 10 was borderline, I will admit that, that is why I gave you a bit of a bonus over other 29-point routes, but unfortunately anything below 30 was out of the top 5.
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Will4563
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Re: Contest #6 - Tour de France [Cat. 1] - Voting

Post by Will4563 »

Micek_52 wrote: 29/07/2021, 21:40
Will4563 wrote: 29/07/2021, 21:01
Micek_52 wrote: 28/07/2021, 14:14 Here are my votes. As usual I went with the scoring system. You start with 30 points, and get 1 point penalty for each constraint, that wasn't met.

9 of 19 contestants got all 30 points, I eliminated one, because their tour was longer than 3.500 kilometres, and three others, who had a flat stage 19 followed by a ITT and another flat stage. Then I decided between the remaining five:

1st - Anderson
Simmilarly well designed as the lukkier's one, but you placed your time trial in a better position, as stage 16 between two M.Mountain stages, and you have a three mountain stage finale.

2nd - lukkier
This one doesn't have safety issues in the start. It is a nice tour, however the 1st place was better, as that one had an ITT slightly earlier in the race, and I am really not a fan of ITT's on stage 20.

3rd - nebe
Simmilar problem as the 4th place. The finale of the stage is the same as in the actual Tour, and we know, that there was carnage just before the final climb.

4th - benoît.guillot
As much as I like your ribin stage, I believe that it should not be the first stage, when everybody is nervous and fighting for the first yellow jersey. If it was the 2nd stage after an ITT or something, it would be totally acceptable.

5th - Bocmanis82
You have three ITT's of actually quite substantial length. This is not really Tour de France like, so unfortunately I could not place you any higher. Also, the first two are quite close to eachother.
How many constraints did I make?
Your route (ID 19093) scored 29.5 points, meaning it took half a penalty, namely for having 8* flat stages (3,4,6,10,12,14,19,21). Same as Fyr3, you did classify 10 and 14 as hilly, but I determined them as flat. Stage 10 was borderline, I will admit that, that is why I gave you a bit of a bonus over other 29-point routes, but unfortunately anything below 30 was out of the top 5.
But it wouldn't have made a big difference if I had gotten 30 points, because I would still have a flat stage 19, a ITT and then another flat stage in the end
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Re: Contest #6 - Tour de France [Cat. 1] - Voting

Post by benoît.guillot »

Fifth place - Fyr3

Your Tour is in the best drawn and we can feel the care you have given to your tracks. On the other hand, I miss a touch of madness and novelty.


Fourth place - Mauro

I loved your idea of finding a theme, I myself am fond of this principle. On the other hand, I found that this theme was not present enough. Too bad.


Third place - Jajojoe

Frankly, between the first three, it was very difficult to decide, so I mainly talked about the subjective arguments. Your Tour had the merit of making me dive back into Hautacam and it's an excellent idea to play the queen stage there. However, there are not enough alpine stages for my taste.


Second place - Nebe

I love your alpine stages. The Bonnette stage promises to be very telegenic and also very interesting. The Pyrenees are almost as good. On the other hand, your start to the Tour does not make me thrill enough.


First place - Bocmanis82

For starters, you are one of the few who have been going through the East rather than going through the center and that's a great idea. Your Vosges stage will set fire to the favorites that do not know these passes and it's great! Beautiful alpine stages, solid Pyrenean stages and it is on the transition stages that you complete this magnificent tour. Well done !


Honorable mention:
- Anderson who drew a very nice Tour but errors in the layouts in the stages were eliminatory (you pass several times on the same road in both directions ...)
- Diego12Alpe with a passage in front of my childhood home but at a stage that seems unrealistic to me (we talked about it a few days ago).
- Antoninvds who is very close to the top 5. It is the fact of having used the finish at Mûr-de-Bretagne AND the one at Portet which eliminated you but I still wanted to congratulate you.
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Re: Contest #6 - Tour de France [Cat. 1] - Voting

Post by Will4563 »

I went looked at all the stages and gave them a score. Then the score is the combined score of all the stages.
Here are my votes:

1st place:
Jekp (145 points)
I love espacially your tour, espacially your Granon and Andorra stage. There were nothing I really didn't like. The only thing is I don't like when you use the same road in two directions on the Tourmalet stage.

2nd place:
davandluz (144 points)
I liked you tour, espacially the idea with Mont Ventoux as the last stage before Paris. Their were not much you could have done better.

3rd place:
Pyrozooka0 (144 points)
You had many good stages. The only thing thier didn't give you a 1st place, was the fact that you put a really long completely flat stage on stage 6.

4rth place
benoît.guillot (142 points)
You had many good stages. Stage 1, stage 10, stage 12, and stage 19 was all good. The only thing I don't like is that you uses a legendary mountain like Mont Ventoux as a TT.

5fth place
jajoejoe (142 points)
You did the same mistake as benoît.guillot, TT on Mont Ventoux, but you did also have many good stages like stage 9, 15, 18 and 20.

If you want to see your score unfold the spoiler.
Spoiler!
141 points: Fyr3, antoninvds
140 points: Micek_52, alegaard, Bocmanis82, nebe
139 points: Diego12alpe
138 points: JoostvandeBeek, jibvalverde
136 points: lukkier
130 points: mauro, Belgian4444
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Re: Contest #6 - Tour de France [Cat. 1] - Voting

Post by benoît.guillot »

Will4563 wrote: 08/08/2021, 10:164rth place
benoît.guillot (142 points)
You had many good stages. Stage 1, stage 10, stage 12, and stage 19 was all good. The only thing I don't like is that you uses a legendary mountain like Mont Ventoux as a TT.
Hum... I think there is a mistake... Mt Ventoux is climb two times during the stage Malaucène - Station du Mont Serein. I didn't use it as a TT... You must have mixed stages up with my penultimate stage wich is a ITT climbing the Montagne de Laberou in the Pyrénées...
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Re: Contest #6 - Tour de France [Cat. 1] - Voting

Post by Will4563 »

benoît.guillot wrote: 09/08/2021, 9:12
Will4563 wrote: 08/08/2021, 10:164rth place
benoît.guillot (142 points)
You had many good stages. Stage 1, stage 10, stage 12, and stage 19 was all good. The only thing I don't like is that you uses a legendary mountain like Mont Ventoux as a TT.
Hum... I think there is a mistake... Mt Ventoux is climb two times during the stage Malaucène - Station du Mont Serein. I didn't use it as a TT... You must have mixed stages up with my penultimate stage wich is a ITT climbing the Montagne de Laberou in the Pyrénées...
Yeah, it was your first ITT i thought their was to long, sorry for making the mistake, but the points is still the same.
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